Honesty About Patsystan at 911Blogger? Go Figure!

gretavo's picture

Hell may or may not have frozen over, but check out some of the comments on the Pork Chop Wire Transfer story over at Shill Central...  I remember now what I liked about Danse.  And Jon Gold, well at least he's learning to use disclaimers when he shills against muslims.

 Confirmed: The Pakistani General Who Wired $100,000 to Mohammad Atta Met with Wolfowitz, Feith and Other Neocons the Week of 911


By the way...

It may be better to say he allegedly ordered Sheikh to transfer the $100,000 to Atta. Believe me, there is enough information to suggest that it did happen... but it is still alleged.

Do these people deserve to know how and why their loved ones were murdered? Do we deserve to know how and why 9/11 happened?


great work on FOIA request.

Thanks to Kevin, Mick and Paul for getting the information released albeit highly redacted.

It does show that the Neocons were meeting with someone who likely was a financial backer for Atta.

Wolfowitz, the guy who continues to fail miserably at every job he gets, continues to get more important and powerful positions within the US government. What a fucking weasel! He obviously knows too much to be cut loose.

please get this info to Kucinich

maybe he will craft another article of impeachment. Hey, the 911 truth movement should also craft its own articles of impeachment to follow on from Kucinich's 35.

How many pork chops did Atta buy?

And has anyone figured out why he was gambling on Abramoff's Casino boat?

These are questions every bit as pressing as the details of the alleged wire transfer itself.

Perhaps the meetings were related to the following:

“The intelligence director told me that [Armitage] said, ‘Be prepared to be bombed. Be prepared to go back to the Stone Age’,” President Musharraf said. “I think it was a very rude remark.” The claims come at the end of a week in which relations between the US and Pakistan have sharply deteriorated, and days ahead of the publication of President Musharraf’s memoir, In the Line of Fire, which will be serialised in The Times from Monday."

Pakistan is clearly on US/Israel's shit list, or at least warning list, therefore it would be wise to tread carefully with alleged documents and rumors about Pakistan.

What do you mean by this?

"therefore it would be wise to tread carefully with alleged documents and rumors about Pakistan."

Would you explain?


Well, for one I would mention the fact that Pakistan is bound by India to the east, Afghanistan and Iran to the west, China to the north and the Arabian Sea to the south.

I'm trying to think of an "Arab" or "Islamic" country that wasn't involved in 911. Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Palestine (Palestinians shown "celebrating" the attacks on 911 on National Television when viewers were most vulnerable; celebration was filmed months earlier; luckily the footage was ready to roll on 911; in truth, Palestinians didn't celebrate [though a few Israelis did;])

Who else? Iraq and Iran, of course. Google "Iran was involved in 911" and be shocked at the number of results.

'US mulling over attack on Pakistan'


Imagine for a second that you read a newspaper headline reading "China mulling over attack on US." Mulling? What are we fucking insects?

It's insane. I don't buy the Pakistani wire transfer -- what self-respecting general would wire money to a some idiot coke-head? Sounds like a blackmail story: play along or get "bombed back to the stone age". Ok, let's say he did wire the cash. What for? How many Korans and flight manuals did Atta really need to leave at the airport? These are some of the questions we should be asking.

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Chris's picture

this is rich:Jon

this is rich:Jon Gold-"Edit: I wonder if that other site run by the "Zionists control the world/the Holocaust never happened" camp still maintain accounts here just to vote me down."

i know its old news by now, but the family guys game is so fucking obvious at this point. "Cheney and Pakistan did 9/11! if you bring up Israels involvement you're racist!". fuck you Jon, why do you hate Pakistanis(and muslims in general) so much?

gretavo's picture

Jon Gold gives conspiracy theorists a bad name...

Thanks for that tidbit, Chris. Yeah, I actually have 16 accounts over at 911Blogger. I post there under the names Reprehensor, GeorgeWashington, Danse, LooseNuke, WISDOM--well, you get the idea. I did not take my ban from 911B lying down! But this is what I love:

Jon Gold: "It may be better to say he allegedly ordered Sheikh to transfer the $100,000 to Atta. Believe me, there is enough information to suggest that it did happen... but it is still alleged."

Believe him? Why? Does he know something everyone else in the world doesn't? What information is there? Allegations by Indian "journalists?" Speculation by the FBI about who ordered whom to do what? This from a guy who says that only anti-semitic Jew haters would suspect Larry Silverstein before his involvement is proven "beyond a shadow of a doubt?" It seems that Jon Gold does indeed have different standards when it comes to evidence of crimes committed by arabs and muslims and those that are committed by billionaire zionists. Whether this is pure arab/muslim hatred or (more likely) a desire to deflect attention from zionist culpability in the events is certainly worth mulling over.

Danse really hit it on the head though, linking this to the recent propaganda coming out about attacking Pakistan because of their "unwillingness to cooperate with the war against al Qaeda and the Taliban". How can you be taken seriously as a 9/11 truther when you actually support the "war on terror" and believe it is a legitimate fight against evildoers?

And then to pretend that he gets voted down by an army of infiltrators from our neglected little site--too funny!! You know, Jon, denial isn't just one of the rivers represented by the blue bands on the Zionist flag (the other being the euphrates--figure it out!)

Chris's picture

Jon has always supported the

Jon has always supported the "war on terror" regardless of what he claims. call it what you want, a "war on muslims" or a "war on hijackers", whatever the case, he thinks arabs did 9/11, and he thinks this based on extremely flimsy evidence. based on his own tortured logic, that makes him "anti-semitic" against brown skinned semites. he hates muslims, according to his logic. so is he just racist? or is he protecting somebody? either way hes shameless.

gretavo's picture

apoplexy at 911Blogger

Is the 9/11 "Pentagon Hole" a Psyop to Distract from Real Questions?


Now let's recap--there are people over at 911Blogger and elsewhere who SWEAR they don't think that the towers were necessarily brought down with explosives.  There are also people there who SWEAR that it is obvious that AA77 is what hit the Pentagon.  These are people who want to be taken seriously, and thank god there are people who are calling them out, as evidenced in the link above.  Those of us who have been around for a while know that these tactics have been held in reserve for some time.  Jim Hoffman for instance was an early champion of explosive demolition but also early on put out the "Pentagon hole is a honeypot" idea.

Now figure that David Ray Griffin, who has done more than any human alive to publicize and lend credence to the problems with the official story, who has written more than five books on the subject, has made VERY clear that he doubts there were any arab muslim hijackers that day, that he doubts AA77 hit the Pentagon, that he doubts Barbara Olson called her husband from that flight, and that he is 100% convinced that the WTC was demolished with explosives.

On the one hand, David Ray Griffin.  On the other, "Jon Gold", "Col. Jenny Sparks", and a bunch of other clowns whose contributions to exposing the truth about 9/11 don't amount to those of one of Prof. Griffin's morning turds.  You tell me what's going on here.

Chris's picture

I never trusted Jim Hoffman

I never trusted Jim Hoffman and have always wondered what his true purpose is. After watching his girlfriend Victronix in action for some time over at 911B(which i will now refer to as shilltown) im even more convinced that my suspicions may be true. and yes, seeing the "quality" of people(like Arabesque and other obvious tools) who push the "Flight 77 hit the Pentagon" theory makes me wonder more and more about what really hit the Pentagon. sometimes these shills are useful in ways they probably didnt anticipate.

gretavo's picture

bang - nail on head

"sometimes these shills are useful in ways they probably didnt anticipate."

Bad liars do their cause a great disservice because though they might fool some of the people some of the time, they are eventually exposed and then one can work backwards and make reasonable assumptions with regard to the things they lied about (i.e. that the opposite of what they claimed to be true is true.) One of the easiest ways to suss out a bad liar is the old "methinks they doth protest too much" trap so many of them fall into.

Chris's picture

yes, theres that trap and

yes, theres that trap and the one where they are self described "experts" on what is and isnt disinformation(Victronix,Arabesque,etc.). thats a dead giveaway to me. speaking of which, is that why John Albanese seems to be gone now? the guy was obvious. Wasnt he promising to come out with a movie all about 9/11 disinfo? That would have been interesting considering the source.......

gretavo's picture

ha! yes...

Albanese was going to come out with a true "Insider's Guide" to disinformation in the 9/11 truth movement. No doubt he was going to "expose" Nico Haupt and the other no-planers as disinfo agents, as well as people who "sowed divisiveness" by calling bullshit on (certain) people's bullshit. That was back when these creeps actually thought they were flying high. Now they realize that they chose poorly and are much less willing to be the ones to put their name and likeness to obvious lies. Of course I have a nagging suspicion that most truthers who use their "real names" are dishonest, and probably have several "real names" on several "real passports" from a variety of "real countries". Nudge nudge wink wink...

Jpass's picture

Danse The Nutter

Danse is a nutter. He confirmed that when he had that 'episode' here at WTCDemolition.com. I was deeply insulted, and then he went on some sort of 'n#@ger rant' that I did not understand one bit..all the while claiming he had no influence at Truthaction or other 9/11 Truth discussion zones.

Then, at his request, I was selected for 'moderation' with no explanation, my discussions were locked, and eventually deleted from truthaction.org. No response, no explanation...nothing.

Anyway, no love for Danse. I was banned from 911Blogger.com with no explanation from anyone...for saying exactly what Danse is saying now. Only difference is I was saying it years ago.

Pointing out the obvious in 2008 on issues that have been draining energy since 2001 is like rewarding a lazy husband with sex for doing his own dishes or washing his own dirty ass.

EDIT: BTW- I posted the first repsonse to this blog you are quoting from. My comment said "GeorgeWashington, I am not aware that this wire transfer has been confirmed. Do you have some sort of evidence to back up the claim that I am not aware of?"

Comment was never "ok'd" by the thought moderators at 911Blogger.com. What is fucked up is that these guys can mod. away anything at all with no explanation. It never happened.

gretavo's picture

thanks for reminding us of that J

you're right to bring it up. see how easy it is to be caught up by the fake debate over there? speaking for myself in this case. especially when they censor everything they don't want showing up as you point out. still, i'm glad that they are at least feeling forced to include those caveats about the pork chop transfer. is it part of a plan to create ostensible diversity masking actual uniformity? i don't doubt it for a second. is Danse saying all these good points in order to go on an N-word rant at some point to then discredit himself and make everyone think that people who doubt Pakistani involvement also hate black people? nothing would surprise me.

Jpass's picture

What do you think of

No problem. What I am curious about is what do you all think of this guy Daniel Hopsicker?

I was really interested when he did his interviews with the alleged Hijacker's alleged girlfriend, Amanda Keller, who now says she made the shit up about Atta, coke parties, and cut up kittens.

The reason I ask is because I've seen a re-emergence of Daniel Hopsicker references lately. For example, Danse mentions a few in this blog.

1. Atta was a coke-head
2. Atta was seen on Jack Abernoff's gambling boat

Seems to me the idea here is to replace debunked bullshit like that pork transfer with more...less debunked bullshit from Daniel Hopsicker, who believes that the 'cult of controlled demolition' is bad bad news for 9/11 Truth.

He was brought back into the picture lately during that 911 Symposium thing that happened up in New Hampshire. Shill festeroo if you ask me. Gold, Hicks, & Hopsicker in the same room? Hah.

Anyway, back to work.

gretavo's picture

Daniel Lihopsicker?

Early "truther", obvious plant as far as I'm concerned. Basically anyone who at this point is trying to downplay explosive demolition (controlled in the case of WTC7, not very controlled in case of twin towers) cannot possibly be anything other than a) an idiot or b) dishonest. All this talk of what is or isn't "good for the movement" is the biggest crock of shit going these days. A case in point is Jon Gold's VERY tired argument that our best evidence is that which the mainstream media don't try to "debunk", regardless of how poor a job they do "debunking" it. This amounts to saying that we should let the mainstream media determine what we should and should not be promoting. It seems not to occur to Jon Gold that the reason that the mainstream media does not bother challenging claims of Patsystani wire transfers, etc. is that those claims are no threat whatsoever to the official story. They are only threatening, if true, to Pakistan. If and when they feel the need, I assure you the mainstream media WILL in fact start covering the pork chop transfer, as a way of deflecting attention from controlled demolition once their attempts to "debunk" the "theory" are rejected by an increasingly aware and idiot-proofed public.

I have to say that I also noticed Lihopsicker's work creeping into the discourse after years of benign neglect. This at the same time as the rise of a cadre of new "anonymous truthers" trying to pretend we're still in 2004, arguing in a way that suggests they either haven't read or don't think much of any of David Griffin's books, which are far and away the best written, most thoroughly researched, not to mention SUCCESSFUL 9/11 books in print. FAR and AWAY. The only people who could possibly fall for this latest (one hopes final) act are people who are new to 9/11 truth and have no "institutional memory" of the kind that old timers like us do. That's why I ALWAYS mention Griffin to people, right after giving them an architects and engineers card. Just like we ended up seeing through the fake truthers, the public will too, but we can't just take that for granted--we have to continue to hammer away at the fake truthers' lies.

gretavo's picture

FOIA is a joke in your town

Seriously people--does anyone think that an FOIA request is a magical truth telling instrument? Does anyone think that really damaging stuff gets released just because Joe Public decides to write and ask for it? I wonder about Kevin Ryan now--what the hell is he doing trying to frame Patsystan for supporting weirdos who didn't hijack anything? Could it be that this UL water tester/whistleblower is one of the last fake truthers with any remaining credibility? Anyway FOIA should be FAYK - For All You Know...

Jpass's picture

What was that falacy?

I remember a recent blog about popular fallacies. What is it called when you claim two things to be true, and then proceed to introduce proof that claim B is correct. All the while, claim A is assumed to be correct.

For example:

Confirmed: General who wired money to Atta met with Wolfy

claim 1 - General Wired Cash To Hijacker (assumed)
claim 2 - General met with high level US Officials (proven)

Back to work for real.

gretavo's picture

how about the existential fallacy?

There may be a better one, but I like the use of unicorns in the example...

Existential fallacy
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
The existential fallacy, or existential instantiation, is a logical fallacy committed in a categorical syllogism that is invalid because it has two universal premises and a particular conclusion. In other words, for the conclusion to be true, at least one member of the class must exist, but the premises do not establish this.


All inhabitants of other planets are friendly, and all Martians are inhabitants of another planet. Therefore, some Martians are friendly. (The conclusion assumes there really are some Martians in existence.)
All unicorns are animals, therefore some animals are unicorns. (This conclusion assumes that unicorns exist.)
The existential fallacy is a syllogistic fallacy. Modern logical constructs, however, allow for conditional logic ("If unicorns existed...")

gretavo's picture

"please get this info to Kucinich"


Lazlo Toth's picture

All yooz folks are so right on the money!

Has it been only a year now since we started hangin’ out at Gret’s pad after the 911B purge and Night of the Long Knives? Is DZ still on that “ghost ship” off of Madagascar? Man, it seems more like an intense 2½ years, to be honest. Muchos Gracias, Gt for giving all the wise-ass, smart kids, who got kicked out of shilltown, a room to hang in and talk smart-true-cutting-edge shit, and prove to each other that we’re not completely alone in a vast sea of shillery, because if you’re smart and independent-minded, but you can’t find any company on that level, well, it’s not a good scene at all, to say the least. It’s a true drag on the levers of creative and intellectual enthusiasm. You know, it’s like you’re a chess player, or a musician, or a ball player, but you can’t find anyone who plays in your neighborhood. Not good. Thank G-d for the internet tubes. Fight for your right to blog and tell the truth! Even if they kill you, at least you stood up for truth and justice under all conditions. Life! Pay Attention: THIS IS AN IMPORTANT TEST...

And Wow, what a great talking your pent-up minds thread here! This is like the wizened old veteran info-war story room, with “yeah, we’ve seen this jazz several hundred times now. It’s gettin’ fucking old and just super stupid at this point. We’ve seen this band before, ya know, and once you hear their first three songs, all the rest are pretty much variants on the first three.” So now it seems they’re reviving the shill careers of LIHOPsicker and Hicks—early Gatekeepers of the “controlled-opposition” wing of the “9/11 truth movement”—useful in keeping the ‘newbies’ from straying too close to the actual truths. Will we be seeing Mike Ruppert again any time soon, or has he finally retired from the company?

MISSION #1 – Keep the sheeple eyes on this ball - Blame the Muslims (which is the whole damn purpose of the false Islamic flag flown during 9/11), and if ultimately necessary, hang the op on Bush, Cheney and the other Goyim helpers, but BY ALL MEANS (and MSM Media) NECESSARY, AND AT ALL TIMES, cover the operative hand of Israel, because if discovered, it might cause a rise in “anti-Semitism” and bring about as well the complete collapse of the “House of Cards.” Also don’t let the sheeple know that the Arabs are the only real Semites in this entire equation.

Yeah, Gretavo, I also kept thinking that it was quite strange how DRG’s work is so tight, yet not so well appreciated, read, or promoted at certain “truth” venues. I began noticing this interesting trend developing over at 911B and other places where Griffin’s research and scholarly integrity were being questioned by people who didn’t seem, for some odd reason, to appreciate the RESULTS of his research, i.e. his research was ruining their well-contrived narratives and fucking with their missions. The phone calls from passengers, all speaking in very calm tones, but describing violent hijackings, were used to build up the hijacker narration in the “official” story. If these calls, as has been pretty much demonstrated by now, are fake, i.e. having been produced in a sound lab ahead of time, then the structure upon which the hijacker narrative is based begins to crumble severely, in addition to its many other problems.

“THE HIJACKER MYTH MUST BE MAINTAINED AT ALL COSTS! The rental and insurance costs alone on those SPC Flight Termination Units were insanely expensive, and we didn’t come this far down the road to have a bunch of goddamned left-wing commie troublemaking dissident hippy blogger motherfuckers take us down. God, I hate these fucking people!”

The whole purpose of 9/11 as a false flag operation was to convince us that the Islamic world wants to wage war on the West, so that we would naturally want to wage war against the Islamic world (and thus, oh so coincidentally, erase from the “page of time” all of Israel’s enemies). Pretty slick, eh?

Another unpleasant aspect of Dr. Griffin’s research and assessment of 9/11 that these “truthers” don’t care for is that he doesn’t see any Boeing 757 at the Pentagon, of course, neither does any other honest, intelligent person (not working for al-CIAdamossada). Anyone who believes that a gigantic commercial jetliner crashed so hard into the Army Accounting Department side of the Pentagon that the plane’s molecular structure liquefied and disappeared, really needs to attend a basic course in science as soon as possible. Also, again with the photographic crime scene evidence, there ain’t no fucking Boeing 757 at the Pentagon in the first place. Look at the photos taken on that day at the Pentagon. Photoshop artists don’t work that fast. I also began to notice that various 9/11 “truther” sayanim were giving lip service to the idea that, while Drs. Griffin and Jones were “certainly respected,” their conclusions were a little shaky or extreme, and they also did not appreciate that Dr. Jones and Christopher Bollyn were friends. This was a perfect opportunity to associate Jones with Bollyn and thereby discredit Jones’ solid CD research. And the CD angle is highly problematic to the false flag Muslim attack version of 9/11 because the inside CD operation leads right to Lucky Larry’s office which is a virtual portal into Israeli finances and politics. Yes, the devious little minds of these agents never rest as they look in their tool bags for the next tired lie or con. I also have found it interesting that hardly any of the “truthers” I have come in contact with had read “Debunking 9/11 Debunking” or any of Griffin’s other solid pieces of research. Is this because the “official” 9/11 truth movement does not promote him as much as it once did when under previous management? Spend more time reading Griffin, less time reading 911B. To echo Gretavo, “Don’t forget to read books.” Take a journey.

Chris, your description of the Jon Gold playbook was pretty much, uh yeah, I have nothing further to add to the counselor’s statement. It is amazing what we’re seeing. It is one thing to read about a game, but then to see it in action right before you is pretty amazing, as well as shocking and quasi-disarming. Great comments. Thx!

And hey, Jpass I’m sorry if I got perhaps a bit too heavy and lectury with you last week. All week I was under a bit of transformational info stress in adjusting my psyche to handle all the upcoming, unpleasant realities of a world war. Also, I forgot to mention to you (and to myself as well) that up north here in Kanadia you can technically be prosecuted and serve jail time under “Hate Laws” for talking shit about Israel or Zionist connections to stuff like 9/11 and OKC, or taking unauthorized research paths concerning the holocaust, etc. Bruce in Germany lives under the same mental duct tape type situation. We never thought we would ever see this happen. As I have said before, and I mean it, you are my brother and a great American, and I honour your spirit. Stay strong, meditate, and pray. Be brave. Take care of your town and neighbors. We will come out at the other end, one way or another. The evil men think that there is no judgment on the other end of their actions. I am not so sure that that is true at all.

Jpass's picture

No problem at all

"And hey, Jpass I’m sorry."

No problem at all. I thought about the discussion many times since.

My apologies also. I came off more harsh then I had intended when I talked about not trusting people like you that choose to hide their identity when participating as 911 Truth activists.

After reviewing my 9/11 Truth world-view I found many people using 'real names' who I absolutely do not trust as authentic, truth seeking activists.

Take care.

kate of the kiosk's picture


nicely said aboowt the real-names!

kate of the kiosk's picture

lazlo on bollyn?

"...did not appreciate that Dr. Jones and Christopher Bollyn were friends. This was a perfect opportunity to associate Jones with Bollyn and thereby discredit Jones’ solid CD research. "

so, Lazlo, what do you think of Bollyn's research, approach, effect? we all could benefit...

how does he discredit Jones's (if only one syllable, you can use the extra 's) research?

my thoughts are that he is very "germanic", perhaps germanophiliac, in reaction although he has distanced himself from hufshmidt and neonaziists

i think his writing is simplistic and repetitive at times, yet diligent and quite elucidatingly clear.

 i have learned a great deal from him



Lazlo Toth's picture

Hey Kate, about Chris Bollyn:

On his general research and information, I have actually found a great deal of it to be corroborated by sources other than him, so I don’t really have a super big problem with Chris Bollyn’s info in general. His presentation style, however, occasionally slips into the monolithic “Jews did it” mode, and this can either be how a real person, i.e. not an agent, happens to express and understand this information, or a sign of someone, as a plant, trying to associate accurate 9/11-Israel-related research and information with, say, the White, extremist, scary, violent, neo-Nazi, KKK, Jew-hate crowd, which naturally discredits any accurate information that might have been presented in such research. The old, putting poison thorns around the truth is a very slick and effective method of disinfo for sure. Whether his employment of the general term “the Jews” is a sloppy conceptualizing technique that Bollyn perhaps developed while working for the American Free Press (AFP), which is closely associated with the (Hitler-centric) Barnes Review, or is just a combination of mental laziness, political frustration and anger, I do not know, and could not tell you for certain. Though he has on occasion slipped into “the Jews” mode in some articles of his I’ve read, I still do not get the distinct impression that Chris Bollyn really hates “the Jews” at all. It’s like people slipping into the old “damn stupid Americans” thing. No one really hates “the Americans.” They just hate the heavy boots of all the wanker administrations that American voters think that they are electing to power. I also feel that Dr. Jones is a genuine and good, moral man, and thus do not think that he would be friends with Bollyn if Bollyn were truly a real “hater.” Whether Dr. Jones would hang with Hufschmidt and DBS, I have my doubts. Also, I think it is probably to Bollyn’s credit that he disassociated himself from the aforementioned duo.

This certainly is a bizarre TV show sometimes, I’ll tell ya that. If someone made “9/11 Truth Movement – The Movie,” I wonder who would play Nico Haupt. Someone with basic Flash skills could do a low-budget South-parky version. Gretavo, put trademarks over all your puppets now. Can “Lucky Larry” be trademarked? And remember, voiceovers and script are crucial.

One of Chris Bollyn’s strengths, I must say, is running down organizational and corporate connections between players of interest and possible interest, and in the sphere of anything Israeli-related, understanding all these connections is often confusing, yet is crucial, especially so in a world tightly connected through the three spheres of religion, politics, and business simultaneously. The shells and sub-shells are many, and it is a very serious game.

When I mentioned that a method used by “disinfo-tools” to discredit Dr. Jones’ physical evidence research was to associate him with Bollyn, I was not saying necessarily that there is anything seriously wrong with Bollyn’s information, only that, because of the drama that had ensued around his arrest and his previous associations, he has been painted, fairly or unfairly, as a “hater,” and thus a verboten source of info on the “mysteries” of 9/11. So all I was trying to point out, and I apologize for not being more precise, was that “disinfo-tools” inside the “official” 9/11 truth movement, and those already working outside of it, have been, and will in the near future, try to discredit the CD research of Dr. Jones by associating him with Bollyn. Whether Bollyn is real or is a plant is irrelevant to this technique of using his “image” in a disinfo campaign against 9/11 CD research. And why is shutting down the “church of controlled demolition” so important? It is because it is the most direct path back to, not only the idea of 9/11 being an “inside” job, but also one with Israeli fingerprints all over it, which goes against the whole goal of flying an Arab flag during the operation in the first place. CD does not point in the direction of the Arabs, and that is a big problem for the subjects of many of Chris Bollyn’s articles. I hope this explained a bit better my intuitions and thoughts on this subject.

kate of the kiosk's picture


"...Whether Bollyn is real or is a plant is irrelevant to this technique of using his “image” in a disinfo campaign against 9/11 CD research..."

was reading your former post in late-night tired mode...

hey, going on much-needed respite. will try to log onto lap top occasionally to peek into the wtcdemo site. hate to miss any of the intrigue, but more importantly, the research!

thank you for your empowering and nurturing posts.

Chris's picture

thanks, and great comments

thanks, and great comments yourself(in the Barry Jennings thread). its not very often i feel the need to favorite a thread because of comments contained within. keep up the real truthing.

Jpass's picture

Exchange Might Make You Sick

Wow, things are exactly the same as they were two years ago. These guys are really intent on keeping the Muslim hating spirit alive over at 911Blogger. Follow this exchange as Gold flashes his coveted '911 Family Members Card' and then summons "Reprehensor" (ooo..shudder) to help him deal with someone (em7) who has obviously figured out how ridiculous it is to claim that 'muslim's did it' when we know the WTC Complex was destroyed with explosives.

em7 will soon be tossed into the Moderated Bin where he will grow tired of waiting for faceless, nameless cowards like Reprehensor and Jon Gold who feel they can 'moderate' 911 Truth Activist. What nerve. That his take on 9/11 Truth is being moderated by some faceless coward is an insult that will backfire I'm sure.

Notice the John Doremi has entered the picture once again. Fuck, they use the same played out shill-whores. These guys are loose. The sad thing is that these cowards moderate all discussion. So, instead of engaging the conversation, we have to sit here and have a discussion about a discussion that is taking place else where.

The following exchange might make you sick.

Jon Gold
"It may be better to say he allegedly ordered Sheikh to transfer the $100,000 to Atta. Believe me, there is enough information to suggest that it did happen... but it is still alleged."

"Believe me, there is enough information to suggest that it did happen..-jon gold"

Sorry, but i dont really like to just "believe" people on such things, i prefer to see some actual evidence.
Why should i speculate on someones 'believes' ?
This whole story seems really dubious to me.

Jon Gold
Don't believe me. Do your own research.

Yes, ive done my own research. And i came to the conclusion that this story is highly dubious from a to z.
Its very speculative, and the sources are dubious too. Not even to mention the conflicts of interest ....
Also, as Danse points out below, even if it were true, what does it mean?
It seems quite weird to me that someone who thinks the demolition of the towers is 'speculation' would consider this whole story as bulletproof.
Sounds like a double-standard to me.

Jon Gold
I've done the research, and it doesn't seem very speculative, and the sources don't seem dubious. Nor did I say it was bulletproof. What is EXTREMELY apparent is the 9/11 Commission's obvious cover-up of this story.

Incidentally, when's the last time a hit piece, or documentary designed to debunk something mentioned the allegation that Lt. General Mahmood Ahmed ordered Omar Sheikh to wire transfer $100k to Mohammad Atta, and showed that it didn't happen? Never?

"incidentally, when's the last time a hit piece, or documentary designed to debunk something mentioned the allegation that Lt. General Mahmood Ahmed...jon gold"

I dont know, probably never because nobody really cares about this story?
It doesnt really challenge the 911 myth of freedom-hating muslim hijackers, there isnt all that much to "debunk" here.
And even if true, it doesnt really mean all that much. So why bother.
It sounds more like useful confusion and somkescreen to me.
Anyways , Jon, your "see they dont 'debunk' this because they can't - unlike CD which can be debunked so easily" argument is getting really really tiring.
It seems to be all you got, but its obviously totally flawed, as many people have pointed out again and again.

Jon Gold
"I dont know, probably never because nobody really cares about this story?"

Which is why the families submitted a question about this very subject to the 9/11 Commission in the hopes that they would answer it. Which is why this story has shown up in 90% of all 9/11 related books written, as well as 9/11 related movies made.

"It doesnt really challenge the 911 myth of freedom-hating muslim hijackers, there isnt all that much to "debunk" here."

It's the Real Thing.

"And even if true, it doesnt really mean all that much. So why bother."

Doesn't sound to me like you're someone that's really interested in the truth about 9/11. Maybe you're just someone that likes to bother me?

"It seems to be all you got, but its obviously totally flawed, as many people have pointed out again and again."

Pakistan's connection to 9/11 is all I got? Controlled Demolition isn't used against us at every opportunity? Something tells me that your idea of flawed, and my idea of flawed are two totally different things.

Now em7, as Reprehensor told you, stop being my gadfly.


casseia's picture

But wait! There's more!

Featuring my own personal gadfly/internet stalker (I can call her that because I know she never reads this site)

New It's not just you, Jon
The "haters"--I could get used to using that just for the irony--have many targets. Basically anyone they can't bully.
But then they take the risk of revealing themselves to the
site admin every time they vote. I suspect they don't bother visiting anymore--why would they? That would be lame if they really think we're such bad people.
Besides, they've found their bliss at jewmoonhoax.com, a magical place where they're free to lie about anyone they want and we're free to ignore them. ;-)
Submitted by Col. Jenny Sparks on Tue, 07/15/2008 - 5:12pm.

New Some of those sites...
One in particular, get the content for their site by monitoring what people say here. Who has the time to worry as much as they do about what other people are saying?
Submitted by Jon Gold on Tue, 07/15/2008 - 5:20pm.

Hmmm.. forgot about the "content deprived"
But like you say, dunno where they get the time.
Submitted by Col. Jenny Sparks on Tue, 07/15/2008 - 5:31pm.

I think the word "irony" might be better applied to Gold's statement about time spent worrying about what other people are saying. And it's great that Jenny feels such a sense of ownership about blogger -- although you have to wonder at the level of paranoia that suggests that we should be afraid of revealing our IPs to reprehensor.

casseia's picture

And I forgot to say...

"Irony" might also be an apt description of Jenny wondering where we get the time to be "haters" given the staggering amount of time she spends online stalking and impersonating others!

Scrubby's picture

sickening indeed

"But then they take the risk of revealing themselves to the
site admin every time they vote."

Hahaha! Im not sure whether to laugh or cry about the "revealing" .

gretavo's picture

god they're shameless

Sibel Edmonds Case: The Central Asia Islamization Cocktail: Mosques, Madrassas, Heroin & Terrorism by Luke Ryland

Read the above post at "911Blogger" i.e. American-sponsored Islamofascism Blogger.  What exactly does any of it have to do with 9/11?  Really, what?  How desperate is the perps' fake truther brigade that they are launching this LIHOP onslaught all of a sudden?  I guess we real truthers must be doing better than they thought--or are they just being extra cautious with the election looming?  But really, to go for broke by shilling so obviously for such a thoroughly discredited notion?  I sense some real disarray coming from the fake truth camp--they seem to be self-destructing--imploding, if you will.  Even the people who disagree with me in public realize that 9/11 truth is not about "Bush letting it happen".  They understand full well it is about the buildings being demolished, and general skepticism about the whole narrative as a result.  Who do the fake truthers think they're fooling at this point?  No one I talk to seems to have even heard of 911Blogger.  They mention Loose Change and Zeitgesit--even 9/11 Mysteries.  They talk about Rosie ODonnell, Charlie Sheen, some buddy of theirs, people at parties--everyone talks about the buildings being demolished.  How stupid a cover-up artist do you have to be to be trying to go back to LIHOP for chrissake?  This is just sad to look at--like a combover.  NO ONE IS BUYING IT, BALDY!


Scrubby's picture

guess what

"The username em7 has not been activated or is blocked."

who would have thought ey. oh well.
now i can't even reply to DHS's latest explanation why the demolition of the towers is "not a fact".
But to make sure you jewmoonhoax-freaks dont miss out on this enlighting insight, here it is:

"I think you are confusing common sense with preconceived notions.

If I told you that sperm could be made from the bone marrow of a female's leg, you'd say "that's never happened before!" but then I'd tell you that it happened once
Same thing with CD. Just cuz it never happened before, doesn't mean it is necessarily CD. You have no proof. You have some videos and some testimony. But nothing concrete (pun intended) to take action with."
Submitted by DHS on Wed, 07/16/2008 - 8:49am.

gretavo's picture

contact AE911truth.org and let them know...

What the management at 911Blogger (because DHS is not just some random user) think about their claims!


Chris's picture

its a badge of honor......

to be banned by such obvious shills like Reprehensor. you were too effective in countering the bullshit. it was just a matter of time. i was banned after countering Arabesques and Golds bullshit one too many times. DHS is one of the biggest tools around, so of course the mods at 911blogger love him and give him and others like him passes while dismissing people like yourself and probably most of the people who frequent this site. notice how Rep allows the back patting between Col. Jenny(by the way, what happened to her? jesus.....)and Jon Gold but wont allow responses from people like casseia and yourself. you gadfly! seriously though, this is yet another lesson in how those shills operate.

gretavo's picture


but at the same time it's a problem if they are able to totally purge all real truthers leaving only the LIHOP shilling fake truthers. it's up to us to make people in real life aware of the history and problems with 911Blogger and fake truthers generally. but also to hit as many online forums and comment boxes with similar warnings, on youtube, wordpress, etc...

Chris's picture

oh its a problem for sure,

oh its a problem for sure, and probably not a coincidence that such shills run possibly the most high profile 9/11 "truth" site around. and i couldnt agree more about warning people in 9/11 truth circles about 911blogger. i make sure that i tell anybody involved in 9/11 truth that i come across, online or otherwise about the tactics of the mods and some of the more "acceptable" regulars at 911blogger. the systematic purging of anybody who takes on 911blogger conventional wisdom over there is disgusting. Reprehensor is one shameless son of a bitch.

Scrubby's picture

The Jon Gold fraud again

one thing i found interesting over there recently is when you see 911-newbies in Jon Gold threads , who dare to question or doubt whether his omission of WTC7 (in those 'super-popular' videos hes making) is really all that good. After all, its what has woken them up just recently.
But usually not without apologizing about 3 times in some way for daring to question the big Family Guy. After all, Jon Gold is a very famous and well-regarded (well, on 911b;) truther who cares about the family members and is regarded a leader, right? Plus hes such a sensitive teddybear. So one has to be careful disagreeing with him, as a nobody newby.
Shows well how things are played out over there.

casseia's picture


Thanks for your persistence over there. My jaw dropped when I saw Gold remonstrate you for "being his gadfly" (and then I leaned over an puked into the wastebasket) -- the hubris of that dude is unbelievable.